- Version
- Download 1
- File Size 286.11 KB
- File Count 1
- Create Date November 14, 2024
- Last Updated March 12, 2025
SENATE HANSARD 14 NOVEMBER 2024 VOL 34 NO 13
PARLIAMENT OF ZIMBABWE
Thursday, 14th November, 2024
The Senate met at Half-past Two o’clock p.m.
PRAYERS
(THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE in the Chair)
ANNOUNCEMENT BY THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE
APOLOGIES RECEIVED FROM MINISTERS
THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE (HON. SEN. KAMBIZI): I have a number of apologies with me here and I will go through them.
Hon. General Retired Dr. C.G.D.N. Chiwenga, the Vice President; Hon. Colonel Retired K. C. D. Mohadi, the Vice President; Hon. Professor M. Ncube, Minister of Finance, Economic Development and Investment Promotion; Hon. H. Moyo, Deputy Minister of Veterans of the Liberation Struggle Affairs; Hon. Dr. S. G. Nyoni, Minister of Environment, Climate and Wildlife; Hon. T. Machakaire, Minister of Youth Empowerment, Development and Vocational Training; Hon. Mupamhanga Junior, Deputy Minister of Youth Empowerment, Development and Vocational Training; Hon. K. Coventry, Minister of Sports, Recreation, Arts and Culture; Hon. E. Jesaya, Deputy Minister of Sports, Recreation, Arts and Culture; Hon. B. Rwodzi, Minister of Tourism and Hospitality Industry; Hon. Brig. General Rtd. L. Mayihlome, Deputy Minister of Defence; Hon. M. Mutsvangwa, Minister of Women’s Affairs, Community, Small and Medium Enterprises Development; Hon. D. Garwe, Minister of Local Government and Public Works; Hon. B. Kabikira, Deputy Minister of Local Government and Public Works; Hon. Prof. Dr. A. Murwira, Minister of Foreign Affairs and International Trade; Hon. W. Chitando, Minister of Mines and Mining Development; Hon. P. Kambamura, Deputy Minister of Mines and Mining Development; Hon. Dinha, Deputy Minister of Public Service, Labour and Social Welfare; Hon. E. Moyo, Minister of Energy and Power Development; Hon. Z. Soda, Minister of National Housing and Social Amenities; Hon. M. Ncube, Deputy Minister of National Housing and Social Amenities; Hon. Prof. Mavima, Minister of Skills Audit and Development.
In the House, we have Hon. Minister Ziyambi we also have Hon. Matuke, who is Leader of Government Business, we have Hon. Minister Mhona, Ministry of Transport and Infrastructural Development, Hon. Minister Mavhunga, Ministry of Veterans of the Liberation Struggle Affairs, Hon. Deputy Minister Sacco, Ministry of Transport and Infrastructural Development, Hon. Deputy Minister Marupi, Ministry of Information, Publicity and Broadcasting Services; Hon. Deputy Minister Gata, Ministry of Primary and Secondary Education,Hon. Simbanegavi, Hon. Deputy Minister of Energy and Power Development and we also have Hon. Minister Tawenga, Harare of State Metropolitan Province. Today we have a sizeable number of Ministers and I am quite pleased at least it is better than before. As such, I will invite Hon. Senators to direct questions to Ministers in the House.
*HON. SEN. SHIRI: Thank you Mr. President. My question is directed to the Minister of Local Government; in his absence, I will direct it to the Leader of Government Business, Hon. Matuke. Hon. Minister, we are experiencing floods that are destroying homes, schools and some people are now homeless, they do not have anything to survive on. What is Government planning to do to assist those in affected areas and also what awareness should be given to the people of Zimbabwe?
*THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR PRESIDENTAL AFFAIRS IN THE OFFICE OF THE PRESIDENT AND CABINET (HON. SEN. MATUKE): I want to thank the Hon. Senator for the pertinent question. Let me say that it is true that we are receiving heavy rains and we have reports from many areas where destruction was done by the rains. What I can say is that Government, through the Ministry of Local Government and the Department of Civil Protection, is intervening in these issues. They will visit those areas and assess the damage because Government has put aside funds for emergencies, especially where schools and clinics are involved. In such cases, Government will intervene.
Mr. President, as the destructive rains befell us, the Department is moving around giving awareness because this month and the next month, the rains will be so heavy. We are pleading with the Hon. Members in this House that if any public enterprise is destroyed, they should alert the local offices so that the Local Government Civil Protection Department should render quick service. The Social Welfare is also there for those who are left homeless and without food, if they report to the Social Welfare Offices, they can get help whilst plans are being put in place for them to have some shelters in the form of tents.
*HON. SEN. MAVENYENGWA: Thank you Mr. President, my supplementary questions is, I want to find out if the Civil Protection offices in the rural areas at district level have a fund so that they can quickly help people because right now, we have schools which were destroyed. We have reported to the Magistrates but up to now, we have not seen any help coming. We do not know whether the help can only be there at the provinces because at the districts, nothing is coming because people report and they expect any answer from the Government because as leaders, we will have made reports.
*HON. SEN. MATUKE: I want to thank Hon. Senator Mavenyengwa for the question. The Government at the moment, because of devolution, is trying its level best that all Ministries in Harare should be brought down to the province levels and also at district levels so that people in need can get help in their respective areas. Let me say that it is something that is being worked on so that the Ministries will cascade to the district levels. The reasons why we say people should go to the Magistrates is that the issue will be handled by the Government straightaway. The Magistrates will get in touch with the offices in Harare so that they get help.
Mr. President, what Hon. Senator Mavenyengwa alluded to is that maybe it is affecting a specific area. I think what he can do is to take the issue to the offices that I have talked about so that the Government should take action. They should pinpoint the places so that Government would help. We know that it takes long because of resources. These re just accidents and no one would be anticipating it but we pray that the Government would help them quickly.
*HON. SEN. ZVIDZAI: Thank you Mr. President. On this issue, I want to ask the Minister what the Government policy is when it comes to disaster preparedness because we cannot prophecy whether there is going to be a disaster or not. What are the plans that when disaster strikes in, for example in Mwenezi or Chikomba, how are you going to deal with it?
THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR PRESIDENTIAL AFFAIRS IN THE OFFICE OF THE PRESIDENT AND CABINET (HON. SEN. MATUKE): The issue that is being referred to, as Government, the fund is there and it has been set aside but what is important is to report and make sure that the report has been taken to the offices because many people do not know how this fund works. They think that if the school is destroyed, they approach the D.O, or the education officer, that is the end. If they report the issues to our offices that we are talking about and if it is taking long, they can get in touch with the Civil Protection whom we know that they have an emergency fund which has been set aside to mitigate those disasters.
So, if there are specific areas which we know that disasters strike or that a school was blown, they should quickly report. There are so many organisations like Red Cross, they are also waiting for such cases. So if it is reported, we can safely say the fund has been set aside and it assists people who have been struck by disasters. I thank you.
+HON. MLOTSHWA: Thank you Mr. President. My question is directed to the Minister of Transport and Infrastructural Development. Now, that we are going towards the Christmas season and that is the season where we have most accidents; how prepared is your Ministry to avert these accidents?
THE MINISTER OF TRANSPORT AND INFRASTRUCTURAL DEVELOPMENT (HON. MHONA): As a nation, we cannot continue losing precious lives on our roads. In a number of cases, such accidents are attributed to human error. We have been raising awareness through the Traffic Safety Council of Zimbabwe, educating the motorists, the motoring public and even the citizens, that we must uphold the sanctity of life whenever we are on our roads, whether you are a pedestrian, cyclist or motorist. We have witnessed some drivers who are driving under the influence of drugs and substances and they have been continuing. We have also witnessed that a number of these drivers are driving public service vehicles. As a Ministry, you will see us as we launch the festive season campaign. Usually, it starts on the 15th of December 2024 up to the 15th of January 2025 but before that, you are going to be seeing us doing road shows, also through the Traffic Safety Council of Zimbabwe.
As a Ministry, we have other initiatives, of trying to educate and conscientise the motorists and those who are using our roads that as much as we partake on a journey, we must make sure that we safeguard those who are also using the roads. According to a recent survey that was conducted in this country, we are losing an average of five precious lives per day and given our number Mr. President Sir, this is quite a disturbing number. We are saying as a nation, as always highlighted by His Excellency, the President of the Republic of Zimbabwe, Cde Dr. E. D. Mnangagwa, that we also build our own country and we also have to protect our own country and ourselves whenever we are driving.
So yes, I do concur with the concerns raised by the Hon. Senator Mlotshwa that we are witnessing disturbing accidents on our roads. Also, to say to this august House, if you are driving, let us take ownership. If you see someone speeding, especially public service vehicles, get the number plate and make sure you communicate directly and we have seen this working. Two weeks ago, we had a bus that was speeding towards Marondera and apparently, Hon. Minister Machakaire was behind the bus and had to report thereof that the bus was speeding and before the bus driver got to Rusape, the bus was stopped and impounded and the driver was charged.
We want citizens participation in terms of managing and arresting those who are perpetrating and those who are also causing accidents on our roads.
HON. SEN. MAVENYENGWA: My supplementary is on the issue of accidents. We see VID officers on the roads stopping public service vehicles but we do not normally see them impounding some of the vehicles which we see passing through the check points. I wanted to know who supervises VID officers because a vehicle passes through them and it is involved in an accident which will be through a mechanical fault yet vehicles would have passed through the VID officers’ checkpoint. Thank you.
HON. MHONA: Thank you Mr. President Sir and let me also thank Hon. Senator Mavenyengwa. Indeed, whenever we are manning a roadblock, there are a number of actors. We are looking at Home Affairs through the police and VID through the Ministry of Transport and Infrastructural Development and other stakeholders as well. We have said, together with my counterpart, that if a bus passes through a manned road block and it is involved in an accident, that Kombi or a bus operator must be charged as well. Through this very august House, I think it will be very important if we also come up with very punitive legislation to make sure that those offenders will be punished. It is also disturbing that in a number of cases after a bus has actually passed through a manned roadblock, you hear that it has been involved in a road traffic accident.
It has been happening and through malpractice again, where we see corrupt officials manning our roads, which is something we cannot tolerate under the Second Republic where officers manning the roadblock are paid at the expense of the precious lives of our people. We cannot continue in that manner. Once again to the august House, if you witness that, please bring it to the attention of the law enforcement agency so that people are punished accordingly.
+HON. SEN. MLOTSHWA: Thank you Mr. President. My supplementary question is, we do not wish for any accidents to happen. However, if an accident occurs, what does your Ministry do because we have seen accidents where people are kept there at the accident scene for a very long time before bodies are collected from the accident scene? What are your plans as a Ministry to assist in removing people from the accident scene in good time?
HON. MHONA: Yes, like I indicated that we need to uphold the sanctity of life and in the event that we have deceased people on that particular accident, we also need to move with speed so that the removal is also executed again with speed. I am sure the Hon. Senator was asking what the Ministry is doing to make sure that we actually work together with the police so that in the event of fatalities, we do not just take it upon ourselves. We work in collaboration with the police so that they remove and take the deceased to the mortuary. This is a process that we make sure happens with speed.
In the event that we have delays, I think it will not be out of our own making but like I indicated that in the event that we have such disturbing scenarios, we anticipate that through the police, the nearest police will come. They will also do the proper checks and removals so that we do not have dead bodies lying on the ground for quite some time. What we are doing is that we have gone a step further as a Ministry where we are initiating through a fund.
I am sure it will go through Cabinet and then to this august House where we are advocating for the Road Accident Fund, not only addressing to those who are deceased, but we are saying the burden of others who are bread winners are leaving their children. We need to make sure that they are catered for and those that are injured, we need to make sure that they are catered for. Very soon you will see the Ministry bringing the relevant Bill before the august House so that we enact that law and make sure that we lesson the burden to those who will be taking charge of those who will be left behind. Thank you.
HON. SEN. TONGOGARA: Thank you Mr. President. My question was supposed to be directed to the Minister of Finance but there are two leaders in the House here and one of them can answer it. How does the Ministry of Finance intend to balance inflation control with economic growth, especially as inflation continues to devalue the local currency impacting citizens purchasing power?
THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. ZIYAMBI): I want to thank the Hon. Member for the question. It is a very long one and it would need the Minister to come and elaborate. I am sure during the budget session, the Minister will explain some of the issues. I will explain a few issues. The issue that we suffer from as a country is largely a question of confidence. Our people do not have confidence in our currency and there is a lot of speculation. Why do I say so? This is because when we introduced the ZiG, we backed it up with gold currency and currently in the circulation, we have around ZiG10.6 billion and we have in our reserves around USD430 million.
If you do the mathematics, the rate should not be above ZiG25. In fact, when we did the mathematics and we said suppose we want to buy all the ZiG that is in circulation with USD430 million, what rate will we get it for? We found out that it was around ZiG23, yet you find that because of the confidence, people would then speculate and say I would rather have as a store of value and keep my USD even if I buy it at ZiG30. The inflation that you are talking about, you will not find it in any economic books. It is a Zimbabwean inflation caused by lack of confidence, which is what we need to do to build the confidence.
Mr. President Sir, I will give you a scenario that happened in this country. In 2009 when we dollarised, this country did not have any money but because of the confidence and this belief that the GNU was a saviour, people survived and there was no inflation because of that. Now when we have some reserves because of this lack of confidence, we find our dollar fluctuating but what I can say is, we are doing all the efforts to bring back the confidence to ensure that we increase our reserves so that we can put measures to ensure that we mitigate this exchange loss that is happening because of speculation.
We are now coming up with a roadmap towards dedollarisation because we believe that using the USD is not helping us at all and we cannot control it because it is not our currency. So, we are putting up measures to beef up our currency so that once we go on that roadmap, that will result in stabilising the currency and our prices will stabilise. I believe that this is an area that we can debate a lot when the Minister comes with the actual current figures but what we have noticed and why I am indicating that is largely due to lack of confidence and speculation.
We have been offering money for sale and we are the ones who are offering and what we are offering per week, the market is unable to buy all of it. We then begin to wonder why the rate is above the one that we are offering. We believe that it is this panic in the population that we need to cure to say that when you have your money, your ZiG, you must be satisfied and have confidence. Once all of us have confidence in our currency, then that inflation that you have been talking about that is Zimbabwean made that you will not find in economic books will go away. Thank you.
*HON. SEN. CHIEF NHEMA: Thank you Mr. President. Mine is a supplementary but I have seen that it is almost the same. My issue is, what is Government doing now that we are faced with the festive season so that the ZiG is accepted in the shops? Maybe it is different where we stay from the ministers because here in towns, it can buy in big shops like OK but where we live in the rural areas, we do not have OK Shops and they do not accept ZiG. As we approach Christmas, our friends and relatives visit us. We do not understand and we say there are companies that are given USD so that they import raw materials from outside. If you visit the rural shops, the shops that sell cement and everything do not accept ZiG because they are saying all our suppliers do not accept ZiG. We want you to help us so that in the rural areas, we are able to buy using ZIG.
THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE: Thank you Hon. Sen. Chief Nhema. This is a different question all together but let me allow the Minister to respond.
*THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. Z. ZIYAMBI): Thank you Mr. President and I also thank the chief for his question. His question is in line with what I have said that our biggest problem is that as a nation, we have not embraced our own currency. We are used to saying that foreign currency is the best and that is what the shop owners think but in our investigations, we want to put in place things so that they accept the currency without forcing them.
As it is, Mr. President, the money that is circulating in this country, the ZiG, is constituting 20% of the money in circulation. The foreign currency is the one that is in circulation. As we are approaching Christmas, we are going to enjoy because the money that we have in our pockets now is 80% but we want to put things in place so that we do not force those who sell. We want to put in place plans so that our money is accepted. It is not a one day job but we will go step by step so that people have confidence that even if you have it in your pocket, you will not get afraid.
*THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE: Do you still have your supplementary question, Senator Tongogara?
* HON. SEN. TONGOGARA: Thank you Mr. President. It was in line with what the chief has talked about.
HON. SEN. ZVIDZAI: Thank you, Mr. President. My question is direct to the Minister of Justice, Legal and Parliamentary Affairs. Mr. President, in the last session, your august House adopted more than 21 motions. What is Government policy with regards to dealing with motions that this august House adopts. Thank you.
THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. Z. ZIYAMBI): If the Hon. Senator could please repeat his question.
*HON. SEN. ZVIDZAI: Mr. President, the Minister said I should repeat. Here we have motions that we put across as a House. What is the plan of the motions that we have brought before this Senate?
*HON. Z. ZIYAMBI: Thank you, Mr. President. There are about 22 motions that were brought into this House. Mr. President, if a motion is brought into this House, the Ministry is supposed to respond to that motion. When the motion ends, there should be a resolution. So if the Minister agrees, he will come and respond. If that is not happening and if the House passes a motion and the Minister does not come into this House, there is a problem but if they agree, both Houses have a mandate to make a follow-up on what they would have agreed upon. Thank you.
*HON. SEN. CHIEF NECHOMBO: Thank you very much, Mr. President. My question is directed to the Minister of Transport and Infrastructural Development. In the rural areas, without pinpointing to a particular place, we have so many different rivers that if we have rains, for children to cross those rivers to go to schools or those who want to go to hospitals, it is very difficult. Are there any plans that rural areas should be looked at when it comes to bridges for people to cross rivers?
*THE MINISTER OF TRANSPORT AND INFRASTRUCTURAL DEVELOPMENT (HON. MHONA): Thank you, Mr. President and also, thank you, Hon. Senator Chief Nechombo for his pertinent question. It is very true that in the rainy season we come across challenges of rivers being flooded and some bridges will not be accessible.
We find that we have some big bridges which fall under the Ministry of Transport and Infrastructural Development but we come across small rivers where people can cross on foot, where they are accessible through foot bridges, which means we have road authorities in our rural areas. We work with the RIDA and local authorities in the rural areas. In the towns, it is local authorities.
What we expect is that on these bridges, at times we need expertise. We cannot just make makeshift bridges. We have engineers who are in each and every province. If we have such areas, I will give you a contact for the provincial road engineer who is the head of all the roads. Even if it is owned by RIDA, district constructions or any bridge construction, if you have such a place, they can give you expertise on how to construct the bridges. If our bridges are not very wide, we can erect foot bridges so that our children can access freely.
You find that many children lag behind as they miss school in the rainy season. If I give you the contacts, you will get in touch with our engineers and then they can work out on how they can construct bridges in certain areas. Thank you.
HON. SEN. CHITSAMBA: Thank you, Mr. President. My question is directed to the Leader of Government Business because the Minister of Lands, Agriculture, Fisheries, Water and Rural Development is not in the House. I just want to ask my question on the distribution of Presidential inputs.
According to the President of the Republic of Zimbabwe, Cde. E. D. Mnangagwa, the distribution of inputs should reach every citizen but this is the opposite because I witnessed unfairness. The inputs are distributed politically which is very unfair. Thank you, Mr. President.
THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR PRESIDENTIAL AFFAIRS IN THE OFFICE OF THE PRESIDENT AND CABINET (HON. SEN. MATUKE): Thank you very much for that very important comment. I do not think that was a question but what I can assure the Hon. Senator is that the seed, the social welfare, the inputs and any other thing that will be coming from Government should be distributed without considering the political affiliations and the religious affiliations as well. If there is any issue which you think is an incident which may warrant to forward it to the authorities, we gladly receive it and I think we can send people to investigate where you think things are not moving properly. Thank you so much.
*HON. SEN. CHIEF NHEMA: Thank you Mr. President. We want the Hon. Minister to explain to this Senate if the policy has changed. When those inputs were being ferried, we agreed that the inputs will be ferried for free. We are now in trouble because money has to be paid. Can you explain whether it has changed, we do not have answers for that. We agreed that people will receive them for free but now they are not getting the inputs.
* HON. SEN. MATUKE: Thank you chief. It is very true that inputs are supposed to get to the people for free with Government ferrying the seeds. As you know that the rains do not wait for people, if the inputs have delayed, people will not wait for the inputs because rains are just for a season and if it passes, it will be a loss upon them. So, people come up with plans that will help them to meet the season.
HON. SEN. PHULU: Thank you Mr. President. My question is directed to the Minister of Energy and Power Development. What benefits has Zimbabwe obtained from the policy of blending anhydrous ethanol with unleaded petrol? What measures have been implemented to prevent monopolies in the fuel blending sector? Additionally, what have we gained - have we gained any carbon credits or tangible financial returns from this initiative? Thank you.
THE DEPUTY MINISTER OF ENERGY AND POWER DEVELOPMENT (HON. SIMBANEGAVI): Thank you Hon. Senator for the very pertinent question. You asked the question in three parts. Can we have it in singular way?
HON. SEN. PHULU: Mr. President, it is one question. Maybe I will ask, then ask a supplementary. What benefits has Zimbabwe obtained from this policy and what measures have been implemented to prevent monopolies in this sector?
HON. SIMBANEGAVI: Thank you Hon. Senator. In terms of anhydrous fuel, we currently have the new S.I. which we promulgated as Government ands now calling for mandatory blending of fuel and this policy is going to benefit us in terms of making sure that we protect our climate because as you know, unblended fuel will cause pollution in the environment. So, by coming up with this policy, we are just trying to make sure that we also adhere to our international policy, that as a country, we are also part of COP20 and we are also trying to adhere to those international obligations as well. We also protect our environment by making sure that vehicles use blended fuel. Previously, the 2013 policy on the blending of fuel was just focusing on the fuel that was coming through the pipeline and we have now added an amendment on the policy to say if you are bringing in fuel by road, it also needs to be blended. This is also to make sure that it reduces the smuggling of fuel through unprotected sections in our border systems that people bring fuel that is marked and we make sure that our consumers get the properly blended fuel that is required by Government.
In terms of the monopoly, I do not think it is Government policy to say the blending of fuel can be done by specific entities. Anyone is free to come up, if they think that they are able to blend fuel. There is no monopoly in the blending sector as far as I know. Thank you.
HON. SEN. ZVIDZAI: Thank you very much Mr. President, a follow up to that answer and the question is around issues of import parity. If you import anhydrous ethanol from Brazil, et cetera, you land it here for 50 cents but our own local produced anhydrous ethanol is blended at the rate of one dollar a litre. What is the rationale for this?
HON. SIMBANEGAVI: Thank you Mr. President. The reasonableness of this policy is in the fact that if we were importing fuel, let us say from Brazil as you have mentioned, we will be externalising our foreign currency but if we are making the fuel locally despite whatever the price that it costs, this foreign currency will be circulating locally here in Zimbabwe. So, I think that will be benefitting our economy as well.
*HON. SEN. MAVENYENGWA: Thank you Mr. President. My question is directed to the Minister of Veterans of the Liberation Struggle Affairs. I want to understand from the Hon. Minister what happens if one has been declared a war veteran. There are categories which are the liberation war hero and the liberation hero. Of the two, in terms of the benefits from the Government, how does one go about it because we are being constantly asked such questions in the constituencies and we fail to come up with reasonable answers?
*THE MINISTER OF VETERANS OF THE LIBERATION STRUGGLE AFFAIRS (HON. SEN. MAVHUNGA): Thank you Hon. President of Senate. I would like to thank Hon. Sen. Mavenyengwa for the question. It is true that we have liberation war heroes and liberation heroes. A liberation war hero is a person who has already been vetted and the funeral amounts have already been set, pegged at 500 dollars per funeral as of now. For liberation heroes, these are the people who would have played a crucial role in the liberation struggle. There is a ready fund that has also been set aside for them. They deserve respect. When the money is there, they should be assisted by the Government. They should be given funeral assistance.
The declaration shows that the person must be given the money even if they do not access the money on that day but the process will be done so that in the end, they receive the money.
HON. SEN. SIBANDA: Thank you Hon. President, I have got two questions…
THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE: Order Hon. Senator! You are allowed to ask only one question.
+HON. SEN. SIBANDA: Thank you, my question is directed to the Leader of Government Business. Minister, cattle are dying because of drought. Government must allow farmers to sell their cattle before they die due to drought. They can sell their cattle to other farmers or those who deal in pet food or crocodile farmers. If they sell, they can get something but instead of letting the cattle die. Why not licence those who deal in pet food?
THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE: Order Hon. Senator.
+HON. SEN. SIBANDA: Why is it that Government does not allow farmers to sell their livestock to those who deal in pet food where they can get something out of their livestock?
THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. Z. ZIYAMBI): My translation is not working but if I got the question well, the Hon. Senator is asking if there is a problem and because of drought, if cattle farmers can sell to those that want pet food or for feeding crocodiles. Hon. President of Senate, I do not see any problem with that but I have not heard of any Government licence that requires you to get documentation for you to sell your livestock to anyone in the country. I am not very sure if it is something that is prohibited but should you know of any prohibition, maybe you need to put it in writing so that the Hon. Minister of Agriculture can attend to it. As far as I know, farmers are free to sell their cattle to anyone in the country.
Questions Without Notice were interrupted by THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE in terms of Standing Order No. 67.
HON. SEN. PHULU: Mr. President of Senate, I move that we extend time for Questions Without Notice by 15 minutes.
HON. SEN. NGWENA: I second.
Motion put and agreed to.
+HON. SEN. M. NDLOVU: Thank you Hon. President, my question is directed to the Hon. Minister of Home Affairs and in his absence, I direct the question to the Leader of the House. We have noticed that most of the young men are committing suicide by hanging. How long should it take the police to come and remove that person from the tree that he would have hanged himself? Also, should that tree be removed culturally or it should be left there? What does the law say about that?
*THE MINISTER OF STATE FOR PRESIDENTIAL AFFAIRS IN THE OFFICE OF THE PRESIDENT AND CABINET (HON. SEN. MATUKE): Thank you President of the Senate. I would like to thank the Hon. Member for the pertinent question. If I understood it correctly, she wants to find out why when someone has committed suicide, the police delay to attend the scene as well as to remove the corpse. Furthermore, is there any law in terms of our culture that the tree should be put down so that we will never see it again? First and foremost, I would want to say that on the delay by the police to attend to the scene so that they remove the corpse of someone who has committed suicide, there is no time limit. The resources of the police station that attends to the scene, if all things are equal, they can quickly go there and should in fact, quickly remove the corpse of the person who has hanged himself.
At times our police stations may not have adequate motor vehicles to enable them to reach the scene of the suicide in time. So, some of the problems could be lack of vehicles to attend the scene as well as the distance to the scene of the suicide. At times, the only one vehicle at the police station could have gone to other duties. So, they wait for the motor vehicle to return from other duties, so this may cause the delays. For a person who has committed suicide by hanging themselves to a tree, we do not have a law that says we must cut down the tree. If a person has an accident near a bridge or river, should we then remove that section of the road because a person died at the scene? It is not proper but the point is, we do not have such laws. From certain chieftainships and certain areas, they may use that in our culture that the tree be cut off and be burnt. If we were to do that, we would run out of trees. I thank you.
*HON. SEN. MDHLURI: Thank you Mr. President Sir. My question is directed to the Minister of Primary and Secondary Education. We have seen the springing up of schools nationwide. We have a problem with the majority of schools that are not registered. As we speak, His Excellency, the President has intervened in one situation where children nearly failed to write the examination because their school was not registered. What measures have you taken to try and alleviate such problems so that such problems become a thing of the past because the schools do not have centre numbers?
*THE DEPUTY MINISTER OF PRIMARY AND SECONDARY EDUCATION (HON. GATA): Thank you Mr. President Sir. I would like to thank Hon. Senator Mdhluri for the question. This is a pertinent question because when we talk about quality and inclusive education, it will not be attainable without the requisite facilities. In response, I am saying, the registration of schools is being done. This year, so far, we have registered 326 schools which were satellite schools. The majority of these schools we attended to were aided by the Ministry in order to meet the registration requirements.
There are certain requirements that are to be met before a school can be certified as a school. They may not be having the said requirements. Schools that were ready, about 65% to 85% were assisted by the Ministry to ensure that they are registered and they will proceed once they have the money. It is true that His Excellency, the President had to intervene. He indicated that by 2024, let us accelerate satellite schools’ registration. That is why you saw we now have such a high figure. Those that are not yet registered is because they do not meet the requirements for them to have the schools registered.
In our 2025 Budget, we are hoping that once we get the substantial amounts that we requested, we can then be in a position to assist them so that they can attain registration. A school can only become an examination centre once it is no longer a satellite school and once it has met the requirements. If it is close to the satellite, the one that lives near it then misleads the community and the children that they will be receiving registration fees for examinations and defraud the people. The nearby school to a satellite school is registered examination centre. So, the children at the satellite school can use that school for their examinations and write these examinations. I thank you.
*HON. SEN. BVUMO: Thank you Mr. President. My supplementary question is on the mushrooming of new schools. What is the Ministry doing in order to ensure that the teachers who are at these schools are properly qualified because these schools are recruiting unqualified teachers, which tend to disadvantage our children? I thank you.
*THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE: Hon. Senator Bvumo, this is a new question and not a supplementary question. I will not allow that question to be answered. Write it down and then next week we start with that question.
*HON. SEN. CHIEF DANDAWA: Thank you Mr. President of Senate. My question is directed to the Minister of Justice, Legal and Parliamentary Affair in line with the chiefs’ courts. Is it lawful for the police to intervene in the cases that the chief would have tried? The police come and intervene because the father in-law has come to say the son-in-law has not paid lobola for 10 years. They go and allow the person to be compensated by a herd of 10 cattle. The police came and interfere and said the cattle have to be returned to the son-law. Is that lawful?
*THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. Z. ZIYAMBI): Thank you Mr. President of Senate. I also want to thank the chief for the pertinent question, whether the police can intervene in matters that would have been adjudicated by the chiefs. My response is yes and no. Yes, in the sense that we have dual laws. There are cases that chiefs have jurisdiction but they can be appealed against at the Magistrates Court. The issue that he has raised needs to be looked into to see when they come to drive the cattle, what documents do they have in their possession? What may need to be corrected would be the strengthening of the jurisdiction of the chiefs so that such variances become less. That is why I said yes and no because it depends with the circumstances. When the police officer come, does he have a court order and what would be the court order to the effect thereof, would the chief be informed that the case has been appealed against, would the appeal be granted or the people will just go there and say the chief has been saved? It requires to be investigated into like I said, it needs to be put down in writing so that we get the gist of the matter.
*THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE: Thank you Hon. Minister. I believe the Hon. Chief should write down the question so that the Hon. Minister can clarify on the matter. Thank you.
*HON. SEN. CHIEF MUTASA: Thank you Mr. President of Senate. My question is directed to the Minister of Justice, Legal and Parliamentary Affairs. First and foremost, I would want to thank you for putting a lot of money in training the chiefs so that they become marriage officers. It is a year down the line that we have been trained as marriage officers. All chiefs countrywide were trained, not a single chief has solemnised a marriage because there are no books, there are no certificates, no date stamps, no communication.
I just want to find out how far have you gone in ensuring that this is done? The country is waiting. I thank you.
*THE MINISTER OF JUSTICE, LEGAL AND PARLIAMENTARY AFFAIRS (HON. Z. ZIYAMBI): Thank you Mr. President. I am grateful that the Hon. Sen. Chief has said I have had them trained. There are those that carry out the administrative work, they issue out the statutory, the date stamps and everything. It is not a policy question. It is a follow up, if he had put it in writing, I was going to ask them if there is an allegation that they have omitted to carry out these activities because it is the first time that I am hearing about it.
I signed the certificates and asked the people to be trained and allowed our chiefs in terms of our tradition to solemnise the marriages. So, please write or approach our offices, then we ask the responsible persons why they are neglecting their duty. I thank you Mr. President of Senate.
*THE ACTING PRESIDENT OF SENATE: Hon. Sen. Chief Mutasa, please write down the questions so that all the other chiefs get clear answers on the issue. Thank you.
MOTION
CONGRATULATORY MESSAGE TO PROSECUTOR-GENERAL FOR UPHOLDING THE DIGNITY OF THE GENERAL NOTICE 870 OF 2024
HON. SEN. PHULU: I move the motion standing in my name that this House;
NOTING WITH APPRECIATION the manner in which the Prosecutor-General formulates and publicly discloses general principles by which her office conducts criminal proceedings;
AND WHEREAS there exist guidelines that enhance independence and accountability of the Prosecutor-General;
NOW, THEREFORE, this House congratulates the Prosecutor-General for upholding the dignity of her office and independence as demonstrated by the updating of prosecutorial guidelines for the efficient discharge of her duties through the publishing of the General Notice 870 of 2024 in the Government Gazette.
HON. SEN. MLOTSHWA: I second.
HON. SEN. PHULU: Mr. President, I stand to motivate the motion on the Order Paper. It is unfortunate that the Minister has just walked out. It is a motion which seeks to congratulate the Prosecutor-General for formulating and publicly disclosing general principles by which her office conducts criminal proceedings.
Mr. President, this is a question that I have heard many people often ask to say; what is the policy of Government in prosecuting rape cases? How does Government conduct prosecution? How do they determine which case is prosecuted, how long do they take, what are the issues that they look at?
Before the 2013 Constitution, there were no clear provisions requiring the Prosecutor-General to disclose how she goes about this. I would like to therefore congratulate her for putting forward an amendment to the prosecutorial guidelines seeking to clarify how that office works.
In terms of the Constitution, the Office of the Prosecutor-General is an independent office. It should be able to do its work without taking any directives from anyone. No politician should be able to phone that office, to say this is how you will handle this particular prosecution. The Minister should not interfere with that office and therefore, that office is granted the independence in terms of the Constitution.
The question of issues like selective prosecution, are issues which have plagued Zimbabwe’s human rights record for a long time. Certainly, with the advent of these prosecutorial guidelines, any member of the public may now look at the guidelines and see how cases are taken forward, prosecuted and completed.
It is unfortunate that these guidelines are not publicised well enough. We would urge the Ministry of Justice, Legal and Parliamentary Affairs to take it upon itself to publisise these guidelines, simplify them and reduce them into pamphlets, place them in all public offices so that members of the public may have a simple way to follow these guidelines and know what to do when prosecuting cases pertaining to their relatives or cases in which they have an interest.
I, therefore, urge this House to walk with me or to agree with me to congratulate the current Prosecutor-General who took office recently, for upholding the dignity of her office and independence as demonstrated by the updating of the prosecutorial guidelines for the efficient discharge of her duties through the publishing of the General Notice 870/2024 in the Government Gazette.
Mr. President, I would invite my fellow Senators to debate this motion even though it appears to be an abstract motion. This motion paves way for Hon. Senators to debate the manner in which prosecutions are done from their point of view. They also can relate experiences that they have encountered in the prosecution of matters, the length of time that it takes, how people are selected for prosecution, how these cases are processed. This motion opens up that avenue for Hon. Senators to take up these issues.
I recall that there was a previous attempt to debate these issues and Hon. Senators were stopped because there was this motion. In unpacking this motion Mr. President, let us examine how prosecutions are done in this country. Let us make recommendations of how we think this could be improved so that in future, as the Office of the Prosecutor-General, consider these matters. They may take into account how Hon. Senators, how Parliament suggests that improvements can be made to the prosecutorial guidelines.
I would urge Hon. Members of this House to come along with me to congratulate how the Prosecutor-General has conducted herself, especially in view that she took up office recently and got onto the business of abating these guidelines quickly without fear and favour. It is now up to us to read them, make recommendations on where improvements can be made. I thank you Mr. President.
HON. SEN. MDHLURI: Thank you Mr. President. I rise to support the motion raised by Hon. Senator Phulu. The Office of the Prosecutor-General plays a vital role in ensuring justice, accountability, transparency and the rule of law in a country. As such, an independent Prosecutor-General is a crucial institution. An independent Prosecutor-General provides numerous benefits that include the holding of public officials accountable for their actions, investigating and prosecuting corruption, abuse of office and other serious crimes as well as ensuring transparency in Government and public institutions.
Mr. President, the prosecutorial independence of the Prosecutor-General is central to the rule of law. This allows decisions to be made based on evidence and law, not personal or political considerations. Prosecutor-Generals must be allowed to perform their tasks without interference from the political sphere. It is important that the Prosecutor-General protects the public interest rather than serving special interest as well as ensuring equal application of the law. Mr. President, the independence of the Office of the Prosecutor-General is of paramount importance. If independence and impartiality foster public confidence in the justice system, it also ensures perpetrators of crime are brought to justice, deterring future crimes by preventing impunity.
Mr. President, at this juncture, allow me to applaud and congratulate the Prosecutor-General for publicly disclosing how her office conducts criminal proceedings as this demonstrates commitment to justice and the rule of law. Castigating interference in the Prosecutor-General’s office by politicians is crucial to maintain independence, impartiality and rule of law. Political interference compromises the Prosecutor-General’s autonomy and erodes public trust.
Mr. President, castigating bias and selective application of the law by the Prosecutor-General is essential for ensuring justice, equality and the rule of law as I have already alluded to. The Prosecutor-General plays a crucial role in upholding human rights, ensuring accountability and promoting justice as well.
Mr. President Sir, in conclusion, I implore fellow Members to support and debate this motion; a motion which seeks to encourage and ensure the Office of the Prosecutor-General discharges its prosecutorial duties diligently and efficiently. The Prosecutor-General transparent conduct serves as a model for prosecutors nationwide, promoting fairness and accountability.
Mr. President Sir, I commend and congratulate the Prosecutor-General’s leadership in promoting transparency and integrity within the Prosecutor’s Office. I thank you Mr. President – [HON. SENATORS: Hear, hear.]-
HON. PHULU: I move that the debate do now adjourn.
HON. SEN. NGWENA: I second.
Motion put and agreed to.
Debate to resume: Tuesday, 26th November, 2024.
On the motion of HON. SEN. MUZENDA, seconded by HON. SEN. GOTORA, the Senate adjourned at Five Minutes past Four o’clock p.m. until Tuesday, 26th November, 2024.